Three side veneer?

[AdamChrap]

I had never heard of this befor. Went to a local mill I found out makes veneer and they told me Veneer cherry and black walnut is going for $3.50-$5.00 bdft depending on grade. Then he said you can get $2.50 bdft for three side veneer. I was like "What?" So i guess it is a veneer log that has imperfections but they are all on one face of the log, so they can still get three good sides out of it. That is awsome, makes alot of our wood go from $1.20 bdft to $2.50 bdft with just doing a little homework. Anyways I was just woundering if anyone knew about three side veneer and if they could explain a little bit more about it and the process they do to make it. I was under the understanding that veneer goes on a special machine that spind it and slices off a very thin layer as it spins, how does this work for three side? do they just cut out the bad side later?

[SwampDonkey]

Adam, he ment 3 clear faces. They divide the log into 4 quarters and allow defect in 3 of the 4 faces of the log.

[AdamChrap]

Ok I see thanks allot, that makes allot more sense

[Larry]

Catching on fast ain't ya. ;D

I'm not in cherry country but we do have a lot of premium quality walnut.  American Walnut is a big buyer along with smaller guys. 13" small end and 8' long with 3 good sides is a veneer walnut bringing $2.00 + or -.  They don't like em that small but don't stop em from buying.  Everybody is slicing anymore so that's how they use a 3 sided log.

I'm sawing $2 logs instead of selling on the veneer market...might be something to think about.

[beenthere]

Adam
Try to get a tour through the local veneer plant, and you will see how they do it too. Some of the plywood mills peel the logs as you suggested and then run the long veneer sheets through clippers to clip out defect as well as clip the clear sections between the defect. Then after drying the veneer, the sheets are laid up into veneer with some of the lower grade in the center plys and the better grades on the backs with the top grade on the face of the panel.

The slicers are different varieties too. Oak is usually rotary but with the axis off center, to give a 'half-round' sheet for the best oak grain characters showing. Walnut is often sliced like flat-sawn lumber, on a straight line. Some mills heat the veneer bolts before slicing to get better surfaces. The slices are graded, and booked for veneer buyers to look at and buy 'by the book'. Very interesting part of the wood business.

There are log grading systems used to separate saw logs by looking at the 4 faces (usually the best three of the four faces) of logs to sort them into different quality classes. A rough method is 3 clear = veneer or grade 1 sawlog, 2 clear = grade 2 sawlog, 1 clear = grade 3 sawlog.  This is a crude but easy-to-apply system. Things like this will be good to know when you concentrate logging and bucking the cherry trees into logs you want to sell. A lot of good decisions are possible when bucking to the best length to get the most for your logs. Considering sweep and crook in logs has an effect on the grade and scale, both which affect the value.

[Black_Bear]

Adam:

Here's a link I used last semester to better understand the veneer slicing and peeling (rotary) processes.

http://www.redbridgemarquetrygroup.org/How_veneers_are_made.htm

I disagree with the title though. If I am not mistaken, the pattern seen on these veneers is referred to as "figure" and not grain. "Figure" displays the different density, and thus color, of the earlywood (light color=less dense than latewood) and latewood cells (dark color=much denser than earlywood) of each annual ring.

The grain of the wood is generally considered the orientation of the tree fibers, which ultimately, for sawing purposes, would be vertical (as the tree grows) and not diagonal or cross grain. Someone will correct me if I'm wrong.

Hope this helps,
Ed  

[AdamChrap]

thanks alot this all helps me get a better understanding of the whole process. I feel i have learned more about logging and lumber in the few days i have been on here then the rest of my life. Thanx to everyone!

[SwampDonkey]

"Figure" displays the different density, and thus color, of the earlywood (light color=less dense than latewood) and latewood cells (dark color=much denser than earlywood) of each annual ring.

True about the density of early vs latewood.  Except in ring porous hardwood like oak, ash and elm, where the earlywood vessels are alot larger than the latewood, the earlywood can appear darker in contrast.

[Black_Bear]

Thanks SD,

Now that I think back it was easiest to identify ring-porous woods with the naked eye. The diffuse porous and semi-ring-porous woods needed a hand lens (no bark, just a small block of wood).