2 man production

riverswamp sawyer · October 29, 2012, 07:40:33 PM

My sawmill biz. is a one man show for the most part. I have a Woodmizer LT 40 that was made in the early 80's and I added a home made hydraulic turner/clamp that makes things a good bit faster and easier....
Is there such a thing as "easy" at a sawmill? Logs are loaded on the mill with a skid steer

Today I sawed close to 1200 bdf (mostly 2x10x16' and the side one by's that go with them) For me working alone this is a pretty good day considering I had to go to town at lunch that killed about 1and 1/2 hours. I also wasted a good 10 minutes screaming and cussin after I smashed my finger between a 2x10 and the trailer........

I have a good bit of sawing to do for the next few months and am considering hiring a part time helper.
With 2 men working will my production double? If not, it may not be worth the hassle of hiring someone.

WH_Conley · October 29, 2012, 07:52:10 PM

It will take a couple of days to get used to working with each other and figuring out what is coming next. Short answer is "Yes", should about triple production. You will probably have to change things around on the layout til you get them the most efficient.

Okrafarmer · October 29, 2012, 09:13:20 PM

Early '80's? Wow, you are running one of those antique Woodmizers! Good for you.

Whether production will double, triple, or not, depends on how good a worker you hire, how well you and he/she work together, and how intelligently you can get your routine down.

When training your worker, be sure to make it clear that their job is specifically to free you up to keep the blade in the log.

Sawdust Lover · October 29, 2012, 09:59:34 PM

I can saw around 400 bf of 4/4 hardwood by my self in about 6 hrs. When my helper is here I can do 800 bf in 5 hrs. And my back feels much better when I have help too! And when I am sawing through a cant he is either bringing more logs to the mill or cutting slabs into firewood. No standing around.

Busy Beaver Lumber · October 29, 2012, 10:04:42 PM

I find it really depends on who you hire or work with and how well they are able to follow directions.

I get tremendous output when I work with my wife and one of my Son In Law that can easily double, if not tripple the output I can accomplish on my own. Then there are other people that work with you that actually slow you down and cut your production in half. You try to teach the later, but if they dont catch on, eventually you have to get rid of them. I had one son in law that was like that. Any time he worked around the mill, he cut production in half because i had to watch him like a hawk to make sure he did not hurt himself or reach into a moving blade. Eventually I let him go and so did my daughter :D

learner · October 29, 2012, 10:06:13 PM

I'm still learning as my name shows but I'm learning Fast! River are you just sawing for people or for drying and selling?
When it comes to one you can saw more and get the job done faster(which means less time charged & less profit after paying a second man), but also a Happier customer of course. When it comes to sawing for yourself though you have to consider stacking that lumber and moving it from one place to the next.
In either case though I believe a helper/offbearer is an excellent investment in the long run.
If for No other reason than it's ALLWAYS safer to have another person around in case an accident happens.

Ianab · October 30, 2012, 02:49:16 AM

What you should look at is how much time the saw is spending NOT in the log actually cutting. With a good helper you can greatly reduce this.

Working by yourself what's the saw doing while you are dragging that slab to the pile? Stacking the last board cut? How long is it idling while the next log is loaded?

With a GOOD helper all those jobs are done, and you can concentrate on keeping the saw in the wood, and that's what increases your production. Sure you can operate most of the small portable mills alone just fine, but doubling the production with a helper is realistic.

Ian

customsawyer · October 30, 2012, 03:46:42 AM

Is that a job offer? :D

WoodenHead · October 30, 2012, 08:12:38 AM

A second person may increase your production. It will certainly make your back feel better. But the key in all of this is to find just the right person to make it worthwhile. As others have stated, some people will decrease your output.

You'll also have to take a look at your bottlenecks in your process. Perhaps you'll need to add more equipment (like an edger) to increase the productivity of the person you are hiring. Or add a log deck. Load a number of logs onto the deck at the end of the day when you are tired, rather than each one individually onto the mill. These are just examples.

WDH · October 30, 2012, 09:48:01 PM

On the LT15, I can get 2 times to 2.5 times the production with a second person that understands the process.

Okrafarmer · October 30, 2012, 10:24:49 PM

Hmm, I needs to gets me a helper.

Magicman · October 30, 2012, 10:33:24 PM

It all depends.

Okrafarmer · October 30, 2012, 10:38:30 PM

Quote from: Magicman on October 30, 2012, 10:33:24 PM
It all depends.

???
What! I didn't say "Sweetgum." I did not say "Sweetgum!" I wasn't even thinking it!

sigidi · October 30, 2012, 10:40:35 PM

I can happily double production on the Lucas with a good offsider - haven't had many in 10 years though :( if ya find one keep em on speed dial.

My latest helper is my better half -she is terrific around the mill, has taken to the bobcat well, but doesn't want anything to do with the mill or chainsaws

Magicman · October 30, 2012, 10:54:18 PM

Just saying that you absolutely need plenty of work ahead of you before you commit to hiring labor that will depend upon you for their income. Picking up temporary labor is one thing and labor will increase your output and increase your income, but it still depends. Paid labor can be an income killer if you do not proceed with caution. All that I am saying is for you to stay ahead of the growth curve and keep a sharp eye on your business.

Okrafarmer · October 30, 2012, 11:02:58 PM

You are right about that, Magic. When we start up, I am looking at hiring an extra helper one day a week, assuming the cash flow is there. If and as the cash flow increases, and the jobs are coming in, or the lumber is going out, then it will be time for a full-time helper. Or several part-time helpers.

YellowHammer · October 30, 2012, 11:38:50 PM

I joke with folks that my mill has three speeds when they ask what my production rates are. Low speed is me sawing alone sweating, medium speed is me sawing with a helper and both of us sweating, or high speed is me sawing with two helpers and all of us sweating. :D.
For me, production easily doubles with one helper but doesn't quite triple with two helpers.
YH

thecfarm · October 31, 2012, 08:20:37 AM

I have a friend that comes over and if I'm sawing he'll jump right in. He even brings his own gloves. he is the type of worker that anyone would like to work with. Was never around a mill until mine. But he can see what needs to be done in just a few cuts. ;D I have an all manual mill and we can put some lumber out when he is there. Most times I only have no more than 4 logs ready to be sawed. I always joke with him to let me know when he coming so I can get 20 logs ready to cut. He has been in the woods with me too. He hunts me down when he comes over.

Chuck White · October 31, 2012, 09:15:13 AM

I have a nephew helping me on the mill!

We usually average between 1,500 & 1,800 bf of 1" and 2" lumber in a day at the mill.

We usually start at around 8:30 and shut down around 5:00, during that 9.5 hour day, we usually clock around 6 hours on the hour meter!

I don't have any idea what the production would be if I was working alone! Never tried it, and wifey says "you will have someone else with you", so I do! ;D

JohnM · October 31, 2012, 10:06:59 AM

Quote from: customsawyer on October 30, 2012, 03:46:42 AM
Is that a job offer? :D

Hey I need some work and I'll be in GA tomorrow night (assuming our flights connect

). Course I'll only be there a few days so honestly I'm no help at all. ;) ;D :D

(please ignore this very unhelpful comment) :-[

JM

Busy Beaver Lumber · October 31, 2012, 04:02:34 PM

Since i don't believe anyone else has brought up the ugly topic I ( if they did so, I stand corrected) , you better make sure you have the proper insurance to cover whoever you hire of you could find yourself in a world of trouble if they get injured.

I stick to just hiring family and extremely close friends for the part time and occasional help that we need, even though i do have liability insurance and the like on the milling operation. There have literally been a few people that approached me looking for work that i sent away because I got a gut feeling that they were just looking for a place they could stage an injury and turn around and sue me.

riverswamp sawyer · October 31, 2012, 09:02:21 PM

Quote from: Busy Beaver Lumber on October 31, 2012, 04:02:34 PM
Since i don't believe anyone else has brought up the ugly topic I ( if they did so, I stand corrected) , you better make sure you have the proper insurance to cover whoever you hire of you could find yourself in a world of trouble if they get injured.

I stick to just hiring family and extremely close friends for the part time and occasional help that we need, even though i do have liability insurance and the like on the milling operation. There have literally been a few people that approached me looking for work that i sent away because I got a gut feeling that they were just looking for a place they could stage an injury and turn around and sue me.

Yes Sir, this is the hassle I am talking about....
Up till a few years ago when the housing market crashed I was a full time water well contractor
(well driller) so I know how expensive insurance is and how hard it is to find and keep a "good" helper....

Larry · October 31, 2012, 09:43:40 PM

To get higher production you either get a helper or a more efficient/faster machine.

With an 80's mill using home built hydraulics I might be thinking upgrade. Setworks, dragback, bigger engine, and roller table.

Run the numbers and tell us what you think has the best payback.

riverswamp sawyer · November 01, 2012, 08:45:06 AM

Quote from: Larry on October 31, 2012, 09:43:40 PM
To get higher production you either get a helper or a more efficient/faster machine.

With an 80's mill using home built hydraulics I might be thinking upgrade. Setworks, dragback, bigger engine, and roller table.

Run the numbers and tell us what you think has the best payback.

But my early 80's antique Woodmizer is just gettin broke in...... ;D Truth is that I am still hoping the well/pump business will pick up again because even though my drilling equip. is paid for (thank goodness) I have more invested in it then what a new LT70 would cost.
The old Woodmizer was given to me from my dad so I want to keep it running as long as possible.

Even though I whine and complain about my old, slow sawmill and production I feel very Blessed to have a mill and something to saw with it for pay. My wife helps me some in the afternoons and I have a friend that comes over to help load/unload and stack big stuff like 16' 2x 12 s.

For the time being, I think am going just keep plugging along with what I have !!

Okrafarmer · November 01, 2012, 08:47:47 AM

Quote from: riverswamp sawyer on November 01, 2012, 08:45:06 AM
My wife helps me some in the afternoons and I have a friend that comes over to help load/unload and stack big stuff like 16' 2x 12 s.

That is a good wife, and a REALLY good friend!