The vent about your customers thread

[mike_belben]

Thats a good question ML.  

I was in the middle of looking for the 3pt lever when elmer strolled up and it all went to pot from there. I dont know.  

The hoses to the batwing would shudder when you stroke a valve so theyre getting a surge that is insufficient to even tickle the cylinders.. No folding at all.  

This means there is an alternate path back to tank that has dramatically less resistance than the work port.  Moving the valve blocks the return line and simultaneously, reveals the work line.  If nothing happens, you have an upstream "short circuit" in electrical world, or bypass leak in hydraulic world. It could be anything from too much clearance space worn into the pump endplates  on up to stuck reliefs, cracked valve, broken spring, fitting inside the rear end busted or unscrewed. Anything.   process of elimination. 
  

[mike_belben]

Sounds like a big ol runaround. I know nothing about hydraulics compared to you but do run 66 series in tractors on the farm. Loss of hyd. Power to the remotes on the 66 series (no experience with 86 but there pretty close) can be as simple as the 3pt lever in raise. If your trying to run the rear remotes to the loader or any rear mounted farm equiptment  And the 3pt is in lift or drop it doesnt work.

Dont know enough about hydraulics to tell you why but it seems 3pt takes priority.

Ran into that with my 966 a few months ago had the loader off for a while doing hay etc. Put it on to load manure and it wouldnt move. I had bumped my 3pt lever down. Put it right in the middle along with the draft control. Just a thought.

Also theres a mcv on the clutch side of tractors that I think controls the 2 hydraulic pumps inside might have a screen? And adjustments. Again not my expertise I just run them and try to fix them when they break. The getting worse and worse doesnt line up with that theory but just thought I'd put it out there.

Thank you for that.. Id have never guessed about the priority without a schematic or such a wonderful tip.  If i am asked to come back i will take a real hard look at that. But honestly i dont care at all.   Whole scene left me a bad taste about even leaving home.  Im happy here ..why go beyond the mailbox? 
What does MCV stand for?

[Plankton]

Honestly I have no idea I think multiple control valve but dont quote me on that.

[Maine logger88]

On a 66 (also not familiar with a 86 but I'm pretty sure they are the same) the pump under the MCV runs brakes steering and t/a. The back pump runs the 3pt and remotes. If I remember right there is a priority valve for the 3pt. If I had to guess it's a blown o ring between your hitch pump and housing if it's both 3pt and remotes weakk

[Maine logger88]

plankton is right MCV is multiple control valve

[mike_belben]

the 2 spool loader valve has levers to the right and furthest forward when seated.  It is exposed below.  There are more levers further up the fender console slope and those push/pull rods that go to a valve up ontop the 3 point tower but below the cab.  This is very hard to get at and iirc from memory has the two SAE port plugs.  


Which one is the MCV?  

If theres 2 pumps i cant tell.  None are visible anywhere.  I presume it/they are inside the trans, submerged and run off countershafts of the gearbox.  But im guessing entirely. 

[mike_belben]

I think the 2 other levers must have been lift arm and i think it said "draft control" on it.. Thats just a fancy name for variable drop speed on the 3 point right? 

[Maine logger88]

I can't speak to what the levers do on a 86 cause I've never done more than sit on them but I'm pretty sure the trans and reared are the same. The hitch pump is under the cover under the brakes on the drivers side. The mcv is on the side of the transmission also on the driver side. This is assuming several things the 06 56 and 66 all have similar trans and rear ends and I'm pretty sure the 86 does too but I do know the 1586 is a bigger rear end than the 10 and 1466/86 but knowing IH I bet the design is quite close

[Plankton]

Just shooting in the dark that it is the same but on 66 series the 3pt levers are on the right next and a little behind the drivers seat. The one on the left Is lift/raise the one on the right is draft control. Only thing I've ever used draft control is for plowing otherwise it's in the middle don't know anymore then that.

Mcv is on the clutch ta linkage block which is below the left hand (sitting in seat) battery on 66 series again.

[Maine logger88]

Also the main and I'm pretty sure only relief is under the seat base where the suspension bolts to the cast. Also assuming the 1586 is the same as the models I worked on

[mike_belben]

Thanks guys, i will keep it all in mind but the layout descriptions arent jiving too much with what i remember.  If he calls me back i will research.  

Until then elmer can work his magic. Im clockin out of that headache.  


I have renamed the thread to one that should have some staying power.  Make it your own boys, lets hear about your worst customer. 

[Maine logger88]

 

 Just googled it and took a screenshot of this pic of the hitch pump location and the typical oring that goes

[mike_belben]

You may have hit it.  That cover was cracked and tig welded.  I see the thread you got the pic from.  Also found a few others, looks like after a certain serial # went to piston pump with load sensing.  

but im washing my hands of it for now.  Its his problem until someone pays for me to adopt it. 

[Maine logger88]

Don't blame you there can't say I would be in a huge hurry to go back at least till Elmer is out of town lol

[Corley5]

You hung around and held your tongue longer than I could have ;D  Good mechanics have patience.  I lack that ;D

[mike_belben]

Well.. Im losing that skill.  13 weeks i wanted to cuss out a drill instructor.  Didnt last 40 minutes with elmer.     ;D


I graded #2s driveway this morning.  Elmer's story is that he got it fixed, and that the farmer ran me off because i wanted to tear the engine apart.  

He's creative.  

Machine sitting exactly where it was.  Reckon it'll be there a while, just waiting for the air to purge out. 

[Crusarius]

If its fixed, why is it still sitting in the field? Thats the last place I would want to leave my equipment.

[GRANITEstateMP]

Mike, I called IH for ya in that 1586. They said they'd send out the regional service rep, his names Elmer  ;D

[mike_belben]

 :D :D :D

[Haleiwa]

IH draft control is the same concept as John Deere's load and depth control.  It senses the load on the 3ph and raises it in response to increased load; it's so your tractor doesn't bog down while pulling a plow.  On a Deere, there is a shaft that goes between the two lower arms and flexes under a load, pushing a valve linkage that raises the hitch arms.  I don't know how IH systems work.  On a Deere, the L and D will rarely cause trouble; it's a fairly simple and reliable system.

[barbender]

Mike, I know you were in a hard spot and could've really used the money. I hope you get to a place where you tell the customer, "the clock started when I got here, and it didn't stop when this guy came and got in the way."

[Don P]

I waited 5 hours on a beautiful afternoon yesterday for the inspector, now I know where he got off to :D

[moodnacreek]

I've gotten to the point if there's not money in it I don't do it I'm done with the break even/go behind jobs.

My father stopped up to my clearcut job, I've got a brush pile that's pushing 20' high, 50' wide and will be 200'+ long, first good snow I'm throwing a match on it. Sit in the stroker and shovel it as high as I can, piles of 4-5" straight pole wood, "we have to save that", I'm like have at it, for yrs I've offered wood to people off the landing, block piles, last job I about begged people for 1 month to come get it, finally took the 850B and pushed it over the bank. I'm done with the small jobs, let someone else over pay and get nickel + dimed to death by the landowners. Yrs ago I avoided bid jobs, foresters, now it's the only way to go, I pay LESS for wood, 1/2 the headaches and if the landowner gets funny I tell him to call the forester.
I'm getting more and more of these jobs that got highgraded 30yrs ago, everything is beat, scarred, I've got a 246 acre job to walk this weekend, as much as these guys love that CTL these landowners want a clean swept woodlot. These private jobs that have been hammered 1x I dont even hide it, I'm going to go in and basically level what's not going to be good.
I need to come see your chipper, I'm at the point of having to buy a bigger one. After another 648 / newer stroker 😆

Kept slabwood cut 14" long in a pile for people to take free.  Guess who cleaned that mess up? No wood goes on the ground anymore, it goes on the truck and gets delivered for $. They made me this way.

[moodnacreek]

If I have to trouble shoot something with a jerk getting anywhere near me it,s over. I used to put up with this even on my own property.  Those days are long gone.

[mike_belben]

Mike, I know you were in a hard spot and could've really used the money. I hope you get to a place where you tell the customer, "the clock started when I got here, and it didn't stop when this guy came and got in the way."

One of the times i was waving farmer over to speak to me that he ignored, my exact words were going to be "i'm $50/hr whether im under that (his tractor) or ontop of this." (His cooler, waiting in the shade for elmer to stop being dangerous.)
It would get the point across but its a bit rude and i try not be.  I like the farmer a lot, hes a good guy and weve helped each other for years like neighbors ought to.  and he really got the shaft in the way elmer steered the whole outcome down the drain.  Im confident i could be narrowing in on it by now.  Messicks has all the schematics by SN.  Theyre a somewhat complicated machine compared to most smaller ag tractors.  Torque amplifier, priority valve, 2 pumps, check valves..