Bar oil vs. used motor oil

Lambee10 · January 16, 2012, 01:14:58 PM

I got in a bind this weekend and ran out of bar oil. :

In order to finish cutting the tree I used some used motor oil that came out of my tractor on my last change. It got me through the job but is that something I can continue to use? seems to keep it oiled well and is easy to get!

lumberjack48 · January 16, 2012, 03:20:38 PM

I used all my used motor oil, when we had 2 trucks, 2 skidders, 1 feller buncher, 2 pickups, 2 cars, thats 39 gals of oil in one change.

I never had a problem using used oil, just a little dirty [ black]

Back when we used solid nose bars, i used #90 cut with fuel oil in the winter, it didn't smell very good, the bar would be green on the end. The chain sure run smooth with it.

chevytaHOE5674 · January 16, 2012, 03:37:13 PM

If you really want to run it I would recommend running it through some sort of filter first as often times used motor oil has bits and pieces in it that can and will clog up the tiny passage in your chainsaw oiler.

Won't mention that used oil usually contains heavy metals and is slightly toxic.......

Al_Smith · January 16, 2012, 03:39:44 PM

Old crankcase oil is some smelly nasty stuff .I save all mine in 55 gallon drums and my buddy burns it in a black oil heater .

I have a 2100 S Homelite that was a west coaster that somebody black oiled before I got it .It must have taken me a gallon of kerosine flushing all that stuff out of it .

tstex · January 16, 2012, 04:51:43 PM

I have seen a post like this before on used oil in chainsaws...there is a reason used motor/crankcase oil is black, it is contaminated with gasoline that was ignited and then emit both carbon and some possible pieces of metal residue. Running this stuff in your c-saw should be for an emergency situation only...if not, the cheapest chain oil out there should not set you back too much...tstex

lumberjack48 · January 16, 2012, 05:20:48 PM

When oil is drained out its already filtered oil, it is good clean oil, turned black from a little soot and going cold to hot also causes oil to turn black.

I always check oil between my fingers, if it slippery its good usable oil yet.

I never had any oiler problems, dirty oil isn't the word for used oil, its used oil, it doesn't have dirt in it.

I used it over a 30 yr period, never had a issue with it, it was cheap, or maybe i was. 8)

Al_Smith · January 16, 2012, 06:07:44 PM

You can get a ton of junk in the bottom of an oil pan especially in a high hours engine .

Now I wouldn't use it .However just for the record somebody did a research thing on it with respect to wear and tear on a saw and found no significant difference between it and regular high tack bar oil .

Oil never really" wears out "so to speak ,it just gets contaminated .The big diesels on the U-boats used a centifuge system and I forget exactly but maybe 100 gallons of oil .It had several canister filters and for all intents the oil circulating though the engine was just about as clean as if it were newly added .

chevytaHOE5674 · January 16, 2012, 06:13:21 PM

Quote from: lumberjack48 on January 16, 2012, 05:20:48 PM
When oil is drained out its already filtered oil, it is good clean oil, turned black from a little soot and going cold to hot also causes oil to turn black.

Its filtered after its sucked from the oil pan and before it enters the oil passages.

When it comes out of the bottom of the oil pan it isn't yet filtered after being run and there is also sludge and sediment in the bottom of the oil pan from normal wear and tear.

Quote from: lumberjack48 on January 16, 2012, 05:20:48 PM
I used it over a 30 yr period, never had a issue with it, it was cheap, or maybe i was. 8)

Saws back then had much less sensitive oilers. They tossed oil onto the bar like water from a fire hose. Modern saws apply much less oil to the bar (thanks EPA), so what oil makes it to the bar needs to be tacky and stay there for a bit.

Al_Smith · January 16, 2012, 06:21:40 PM

Back in the days of non detergent oil which kept things in suspension they'd have say a 5 bucket full of old oil .If they let it sit a couple months they could skim off about half a bucket full that was nice and clear .

Detergent oil could sit for a year and be just as black and nasty as it was when it first went in the bucket .

Paul_H · January 16, 2012, 06:27:57 PM

I was in the logging industry the same amount of years as lumberjack48 and never saw a logging outfit run used oil in a saw but maybe it's a regional thing.I wouldn't dream of it unless it was an emergency and we needed to finish out the day.
We liked to run good fuels and oils and maintained our equipment reasonably well as we depended on it.

In the saw shop here I have only one customer that runs used oil but he is a little on the haywire side. :D

Red Pill · January 16, 2012, 06:42:53 PM

On another note, is there a vegetable oil based bar oil? I've never been concerned about using regular bar oil or 30-weight, but I have to wonder if it will become an environmental issue.

gspren · January 16, 2012, 06:47:10 PM

Quote from: Red Pill on January 16, 2012, 06:42:53 PM
On another note, is there a vegetable oil based bar oil? I've never been concerned about using regular bar oil or 30-weight, but I have to wonder if it will become an environmental issue.

Stihl has an oil that they say breaks down quickly. Unless you spill it I don't think all that much oil from a modern chainsaw ever hits the ground.

shelbycharger400 · January 16, 2012, 07:04:56 PM

parents wood/tree service back in the 80's all they ran was used motor oil, still have almost all the saws, none ever had an oil pump problem or replacement that i can remember. from what they say a few went to the garbage can after they became too costly to fix , mainly wore out or were droped . they went through a LOT of pruner saws. all the good big saws are still around, i dont think they climbed with them. they did it all by hand climbing with spikes and ropes, no bucket truck. we threw out the old waste belt harness 2 years ago, going through stuff... what a joke that thing is compared to what is available now. side note... how long are climbing ropes good for? they are not frayyed or decayed, all look nearly new , they threw out the bad ropes as they got recked.

Corley5 · January 16, 2012, 07:18:22 PM

We ran used oil years ago when Grandpa Whittaker was still alive. He'd filter it and bottle it back into gallon oil jugs. I've ran it in a pinch along with mix oil, gear lube etc. but I prefer fresh bar lube. It's more convenient too 8)

Clam77 · January 16, 2012, 07:24:57 PM

Quote from: gspren on January 16, 2012, 06:47:10 PM
Quote from: Red Pill on January 16, 2012, 06:42:53 PM
On another note, is there a vegetable oil based bar oil? I've never been concerned about using regular bar oil or 30-weight, but I have to wonder if it will become an environmental issue.

Stihl has an oil that they say breaks down quickly. Unless you spill it I don't think all that much oil from a modern chainsaw ever hits the ground.

I was in the saw shop the other day and saw some of Stihl's new stuff on the shelf (in green bottles of course) and asked about it - guy told me not alot of people are buying it yet with the exception of the federal agencies - guess they all switched to it already around here. He also said everything in it bio-degrades within a short time EXCEPT for the tackifiers... Stihl web site says 93.8% degraded within 21 days..

Is it REALLY that big a deal that they think we're slinging that much oil around?? :

beenthere · January 16, 2012, 08:46:38 PM

So when does the "green" start to degrade?
Chances are it doesn't wait until it gets pumped out across the bar to degrade, but begins soon after it is refined :

:

Sounds a bit like the short life of ethanol fuel, only shorter.

Al_Smith · January 16, 2012, 09:19:51 PM

Too much ado about bar oil in my opinion .I still maintain that the traffic alone drops more oil on interstate 75 and US 30 almost daily than all the chainsaws combined in an entire year in Allen county Ohio .

sawguy21 · January 16, 2012, 09:54:23 PM

I remember an old logger than ran used equipment oil in his saws, too cheap to pay for it. He got pithed with me about the cost of repairing/replacing the pumps, I told him I was only too happy to take his money. :D
Oregon offers a biodegradable oil in a concentrate that the user mixes 4:1 with water. Not too popular yet but future forestry regulations may force change.

Al_Smith · January 17, 2012, 04:37:39 AM

:D My neighbor did that black oil thing .Until that is he loaned out his nice little Makita which was a Dolmar painted blue and of course it came back broke .I turned him on to Scott where he got another crankcase for repairs .I told him to take the whole grease pile to the car wash before he brought that mess into my garage .Which he had and hasn't used black oil since .

T Welsh · January 17, 2012, 08:04:34 AM

I have done it both ways,our daily operation use store bought bar oil, but like others said used oil has no ill effects other than making a black mess in front of the saw. as petroleum products get more and more costly I am thinking why not reuse it and its all I run in the processor right now and no ill effects yet. after changing the oil in the trucks I have gallons of used oil to use. and yes you have to put clean oil in the saw not the grungy stuff from the bottom. Tim

tstex · January 17, 2012, 09:23:07 AM

I am not sure how far s-termite colonies push the northern boundaries of the US, but used motor/hydraulic fluids are very useful where I live. If you dropped a toothpick on the grd after dinner, and went to pick it up 10 minutes later, it would be gone!

We have very sandy-loam soil and termites are everywhere...they will travel-up concrete foundations/pier & beams with their tunnels and up to the ridge-boards of my sheds, barns, house, etc. So, I put old towels down on the grd and carefully pour the old used fluids on the lower part of structure siding boards [cedar, pine, etc] and of course on all the lower plate boards...let it soak in and do it again...it is good for about 5 yrs...there are places where i did this and the termites later ate the soaked boards after 5 yrs, so everything does have a half-life, or these are a new strain of nuclear termites. I also pour the old stuff on the tops of my large fence posts...the cedar just soaks it up...keeps the tops from splitting so fast...

Be safe,
tstex

NCFarmboy · January 17, 2012, 01:57:45 PM

You can use canola cooking oil for bar lube. It was originally designed for a high pressure machinery lubricant. Some guys run it in some Forest Service areas because of regulations. If you do use it before storage flush the oil tank and run it some wth reg. bar lube to replace the canola in the op and line. If you don't it will dry into a gooey mess clogging the op and lines. If I could find some tackifier I would run hydraulic oil it's a lot cheaper or used to be haven't bought a drum lately. May try it to see how it works. I have about 25 gals. Probably have to turn the oiler way down.
Shep

beenthere · January 17, 2012, 02:53:28 PM

QuoteMay try it to see how it works.

If you do try it, then what will you be looking for to "see if it works" ? Heat in the bar?
Over the long term, what might be the indicators that it does or doesn't work?

mad murdock · January 17, 2012, 04:27:44 PM

I have been running drained oil from the helicopter transmissions for years now. It does very well. As far as crankcase oil. If I ran it, i would filter it first, then mix it with some gear lube, it is pretty thin by itself. Mine is a mix of synthetic gear lube and 40w aviation engine oil, (ised in helicopter transmissions), the only metals suspended in the stuff is maybe a little lead from gear spacers in the tranny, (which IMO only makes it better).