homemade bandsaw mill, help

[gww]

T
I am slab,stack and stikering now cause to get the saw working I have no choice.  What does live edge stuff mean?
Thanks
gww

[tmarch]

Live edge means it still has the bark on the edges.  Saves me turning the logs to make a cant too. 8)

[gww]

T
Thanks for the answer.  I have been turning and may continue cause it seems like it would be an easier starting point having an edge for the table saw.  These last three logs I painted with latex paint before cutting.  I had heard it is easier then painting the boards.  I did some earlier by rubbing some toilet wax on them.  I had bought a couple cause it supposed to seal really well when grafting trees.  My first at that too.

These latex logs where a bright pink.  I had a can that rusted through the bottom and it was curdled.  The good thing is that since I have no more paint and so far the boards have turned out good,  I know if I get a pink ended board it should be a good one.

How important is the weight being put on the very top of the pile?  I cut some 1/4 inch stuff to try and get rid of waves and it really curled up before I could even cut my leftovers into fire wood.  I am putting my best boards on bottom under a lean to that won't block the sun from the ends, its too tall.  I haven't put weight on the top boards.  I am having a hard enough time cutting stickers every day to keep up with my average `1/2 log a day of cutting. 

I did half of another log today and the blade is slowing down.  I screwed this test up by sawing the few boards I sawed before slowing the mill down.  It still has cut more then the other blades but by doing the fast cut I have skewed wether I have actually addressed my blade wear factor for sure.  It is still cutting srait boards with out blade guide though.  In the morning I got some small wave at some (not all) of the knotts.
It seems to now be cutting through the knotts with no wave but just a bit slower.  Is the wood a bit harder near the heart of the log?

I got tired of trying to roll the log on to the deck and used a chain and hand winch insted.  It really worked well except for an error in how had it hooked.  I had it on my squaring slot and when it went as far as it could I gave it one to many pulls and bent one of my squaring slots.  I hammered it close and it still seems to be square but it still was a newbe stupid mistake.  I do need to drill some holes and put some more leg bolts in my track if I am going to use it like this.  I'm very glad this time that it was not an electric winch.

Thanks for the answer.
gww

[Ox]

It's been said that if you can cut straight (slowly) without guides that you have your mill set up properly.  With the guides installed it should be just as good as the rest of the mills out there as far as a straight cut.  The knots won't be affecting the cut near as much after putting decent guides on.
As far as the heart being harder in a tree.  I guess I don't know.  Unless it's punky of course.  I've heard ash has a "corky" pith, or extreme center, in the logs.  All the trees I've been around being sawed were usually just sawed through and through, unless it had a bad crook in it, and used all the boards for whatever was needed.  I remember seeing a white oak having a board sawed off the top and it peeled up just like a giant banana.  You could watch it "smiling" more and more after the cut was made.  This was on an LT70 super hydraulic so the log didn't move because it was clamped tightly.  Some trees just don't want to be boards.  They just want to be a tree.

[gww]

Ox
Good points

I finished my log this morning.  It cut slow but good till I got to the last 5 2x4s which I was only cutting 3.75 inches wide.  It zoomed through those.  This is the first blade that has cut two logs and I am going to try the last biggest on with it also.  Shouldn't be any knotts in this one.  I may have a small track alinement issue jet as the end of the log is thicker than the beginning of the log when I get down to the 3.5 inch bottom which is as low as I can cut.  I ended up with three 1x11, three 2x11, five 2x4 and one 3.5x3.5.   All are good boards.  I do find that measuring each cut is not giving me perfect diminsions.  It is not off buy much but apparently I am not good with a measuring tape and it is made a bit harder with the little bit of blade flutter where it first inters the cut.  Over all today was the first day with zero machanical issues or adjustments that needed to be made. 

I am very happy to be this close.  You guys have helped a bunch.
Thanks
gww

[Ljohnsaw]

<<snip>>
It is not off buy much but apparently I am not good with a measuring tape and it is made a bit harder with the little bit of blade flutter where it first inters the cut.
<<snip>>

Are you marking the log and then trying to cut on the mark?  What you should have is a scale on your vertical post with a pointer on your saw head.  Use that, measuring relative to your last cut.  If you search the FF, you will find people that have made custom measuring sticks that have the thickness of the the desired board with the allowance of the saw kerf built in to the spacing.  You can either make them stay put with a nut/bolt or attach with magnets so its adjustable.

[fishpharmer]

gww, 1/8" should be allowed for kerf of blade.  So if you measure down from top of cant and hit the bottom of your first 1" mark, the saw will remove approximately 1/8" as sawdust and your board will be 1".  Ljohnsaw points out the fact that when you layout your log allow for the kerf on each cut.  So eight cuts would remove 1" of log as sawdust.  If you don't add the kerf to your total your bottom or last board won't be as thick as you may have wanted.

[gww]

Ijohn and fishp...
At this point I am killing the engine after every cut.  I adjust and then move the blade to just touching the log.   I measure from the top of the kerf to the top of the blade on every cut.  I did today measure the kerf after every cut and then take a magic marker and mark a line on the non sliding colum of the saw in blue magic marker.

I have not gotten to making a measuring stick yet and don't mind for the amount of wood I am cutting (this might change) going slow.  I also don't really know what I should be cutting.  I am getting mostly close to 1.75 inch on my two bys and mostly at or 1/16 under a inch on my onebys.  I don't know if this is what I should be trying for or not.  My uncle has a planer and I have a table saw but for most of the stuff I do I think I would use as it is and just adjust.  I could see having to clean up 2x4s if framing so you don't have wavy walls but I don't really know what is important yet and I also don't know if drying is consistant or if they all come out differrent anyway.

I don't need perfection but are their some general guideline/goals I should be shooting for?  It is hard to try and come up with a measruring system when you don't really know what measurments you want to end up with.

Thanks
gww

Ps  since I added the new jackshaft pullys, I have bumped my head on it about ten times making cutting measurements.  You would have though one would have tought me.  I don't know which saying to use.  You can't teach an old dog new tricks or old habits are hard to change?  I believe I am disproving the saying that pain is the fastest teacher.

[Ox]

 8) about the blade lasting longer due to slower running speeds!
I think you're doing fine just shooting for as close to 1" and 2" boards as you can get.  When you want to build something that really matters tolerance wise you have the tools available to make all the boards the same.  Outdoor farm type construction and buildings aren't so picky although closer is better.  Cows and chickens and bees don't care if all the boards are different or the same, and neither does the roof sitting up there to keep out the weather.  When it's all built it'll look just fine from afar and nobody's gonna be taking a tape measure to check your boards.

[gww]

Ox sounds good.  I don't want to saw for others but thought if I cut like the ones that do saw for others I would be happy with mine also.  You do pretty much seem to handle things like I normally do.  I have noticed on other anomally from my saw.  I think when I cut the very first cuts on a new log.  The one where my head is raised the highest,  I am getting more wave in the cut then when I get to the the board cutting after squaring the log.  I first thought it was a tension issue but I am cutting the biggest log yet, (about 25 inches at the very widest part), I notice that the first cuts are the wavyest.  It isn't terrible cause I always after chopping the log down, end up with a really good strait edge for the boards.  I think my mill is to flimsy for the tall cuts and am deciding wether I am happy or need to beef it up.  I don't have very many 25 inch logs.

I don't think the blade is going to make it through the third log.  The smallest part of the cut so far is 15 inches wide so it might cut better when I get to my normal 11 or 12 inch width but I have my doubts.  I will know more tommorrow.

Thanks for taking the time to throw in a little common sense to my disjointed thoughts.
gww

[Ox]

You're very welcome.  I think you probably have it right in thinking your mill is a little wobbly at the top cuts.  But if you don't have much big wood and can live with it, why change it?  Between a planer, table saw and your mill I don't see why you need anything else.  If it cuts to your liking at the size of your most available logs, good enough!  However, always trying to improve things has merit as well.  Determination (or stubborness!) will take care of most anything.  ;)

[Magicman]

Happy Birthday Ox.   8)

[Ox]

Thanks, Magicman. 

[gww]

Ox
Took me all day to cut my last log up.  The only consulation is that the boards were good and mostly uniform.  I put another blade on but it might have been premature.  It was super slow too.  The hardest wood I cut yet and harder near the heart.  More machanical issues.  Mostly with the belt set up.  I am still using the same belts but both are getting ate up rather quickly.  I think I may already have a pillow block bearing going out.  I can't tell if it is blade or pully but I do know the belts are stretching and needed tightening today.  I will make it better after I eat these belts.

It seemed to make a very big differance cutting 13 inch wide boards compared to 11 inch boards.  Something to remember.

Happy birthday, I guess majicman knows more then I.

I love you saying about learning and can relate to the trying to retain some of what is learnt.

I used the planer on my attempt at chainsaw milling.  It was hard to adjust hard to run and made one heck of a mess and I will only mess with it if it is for something important.  The table saw is a much nicer animal.

I have some high labor boards and I don't really see how people make a living at it.  But my dad keeps saying lumber is high.

I like making 2x4s best cause they cut like butter are easy to move and really seem to come out great.  I wonder if a framing nailer will go through oak?  I am cutting wide boards with the knowlage that they can be reduced to 2x4s if needed but man I struggled today with the 13 inch cuts.  Lots of sawdust left in them too.


I did unload 1/2 pickup of cow manuar before cutting.

Anyway I am out of logs and may have to give my back a rest.

Thanks for the advice/thoughts.
gww

[Ox]

A 13 inch board is a pretty wide cut for a homemade mill built out of scraps - I think you and it are doing great!
If you have a Tractor Supply Company near you, I've found the blue "fabric" type belts last quite alot longer than the regular rubber ones and at the cheapest prices around my.  The blues last longer but the rubber ones grip better.
Thanks for the happy b'day.
Alot of sawdust on the boards usually means too much set in the teeth of the blade.  This would also account for working harder to cut in hardwood.  Hardwood needs less set, softwood needs more set.  But if given a choice, too much set is better than not enough.
I finally got my mill finished today and sawed a punky old red pine to check everything out.  I'm pleased.
Pulled some old downed trees out of the lot as well.  Many more left.  Around 100 red pine to saw yet for projects.  And a mix of hardwoods to play with eventually.  I wanted to make my kids each a loft bed so they can push their desks in under it and free up some space in their tiny bedrooms.  Figure I'll use some of the now-dead sugar maple that the stupid horses girdled 2 winters ago.  Deadstanding that long I don't figure on any shrinkage!

[gww]

Ox

I finally got my mill finished today and sawed a punky old red pine to check everything out.  I'm pleased.

Now that is exciting, You gave yourself a birthday present. 
How cool.
gww

[Ox]

 8)  2 1/2 months of building averaging 6 hours a day with 2 1/2 total days off.  It's been a long 2nd half of the winter, that's for sure.  It reminds me of the old ketchup commercials with the old glass bottles - "good things come to those who wait".
I forget...  are you still cutting without guides?
Just got a call from insurance gal.  Guess I forgot to pay car insurance last month and I have till tomorrow to come up with $143.40.  We'll have to dig in to the savings the wife has been working overtime towards to take the fist vacation in 17 years.
I hate my memory.  I've been diagnosed with having pre-dementia from having traumatic brain injuries.  :

[gww]

Ox
I don't know how long mine took to put together.  The frame was really short.  The problims, I'm still building.  I believe you had a bit more planning involved and may have more important uses for the end product then I will. 

I just posted on a personal message that my dad has early altzimers or dementia and that I believed I was starting a bit earlier then him.  I can't coun't the amount of times I get up a day and don't know why, or go to a store which I hate doing and come home with something other then I even went for.  It's unbelievable. 

I have been married since 1982 and I don't reamember ever porposely taking a vacation.  I did go a couple places under duress due to work and having family commitments.  I believe vacations are over rated and I probly was not the greatest catch for my wife.  She might have looked around a bit more.  I have lived in a few places other then home due to having no real choice IE; army and to get my retirement from work.  I have always ended up back home which is where I like best.  I do know that some people really get a lot of enjoyment and I enjoyed where I have been but its like the old saying,  I wouldn't take a million for the experiance but wouldn't give a plug nickle to do it again.  I really hope you enjoy your vacation when you get there and I do know it makes life better having something to work toward that you are looking forward to.  That why you put the time in on the mill and I believe the type of mill you built is going to give you a much nicer reward then what I did (unless you enjoy fixing problims).

I really think it is something to be proud of that you built your own and even if it would have cost a bit more when counting your time, two things
1.  sometimes people have more time then money
2.  You can't help but know everything about it which in my opinion put you ahead of the game.

I am glad the wheight of building is off your sholders and it is now time to reap the benifits.
Good luck
gww

PS  I forgot to answer your question.  Yes I am still cutting with out guides.

[gww]

Ox

I also would like to say, You have been a big help with my moral.  Your outlook make me think I aint crazy after all and your little common sence advice on the little dumb questions like what to cut have really been helpful on me working out in my own mind how I want to handle what I do with the mill. 
Thanks
gww

[Ox]

gww - Don't feel like the Lone Ranger, cause you're not!   :D  I understand about the dementia crap.  I always say after I screw up, "Don't pick on me - I'm dementiated (duh-men-shee-aited).  Usually it's good for a chuckle from somewhere far off. 
If you're cutting what you are with no guides I think it's fantastic!
I'm glad to have been able to help you out in some way.  Makes me feel good!  I've always tried to help, go above and beyond but I always end up getting trod upon in the end.  And then I'm pithed off to no end.  But it's really my own fault for putting myself out there so far when the other "person" wasn't asking for it.  But I also think that they should try to help me too.  You know, one hand washes the other.
I believe you and I would make good neighbors.
The vacation is all my wife's idea.  I'd prefer to stay on my hill.  But I have to go to protect my family from whatever is out there.
I used to drive truck, regional, for a living and I know I don't like being away from home.
I used to be on farms too and mostly liked it cause I was close to home.
Guess what I'm saying is I'm a homebody!
We're quite alike, you and I.   
I completely agree on numbers 1 and 2.  There's 2 forms of currency in this world:  time and money.  If you don't have one you better have the other.  And knowing your mill inside and out absolutely gives you a heads up on things cause as soon as something is amiss you'll know it, pretty much.
P.S.  My first mill was like yours is now, but worse.  I cut 2 boards and gave up on it.  Took a week just to get the blade to stay on.  Guess it was my learning experience of what NOT to do on this second one.  I've had the pleasure of being around a few factory mills in the past so I kinda know how it's supposed to be.  However, you can't compare much to a Woodmizer LT70 Super Hydraulic either.  What a machine.  Anyway, you're a better man than me for sticking it out.  I'd be proud if I was you.  After all, how many men have built their own personal sawmill?  Not too many at all.  And figure in the dollar amount you have in it, heck, ya can't lose!

[gww]

Ox
unless I do pretty good with the last few blades with few breakdowns, It would have been cheaper to buy boards.  I have probly close to $500 in it now counting the blades and not counting an 11 lb of flux weld wire and what ever cutting blades and stick welding rods.  To show what a nut I am, I used some concreete blades in my circular saw to cut some metal.  I already had some left over from some other job and though they were not optimal they worked and didn't live on my shelf for years.  Of course if I need concreet blades I will have to buy them.

I don't believe I have $500 worth of wood.  I do have a pretty decent pile though.  Its mostly eight foot long though even though I could cut 12 foot I can't handle the logs.  I would be close to a 8x8 shed worth of wood if I used plywood for the floor. I still have 4.5 blades to improve on this.  I wish I could find a local resharp shop so I didn't have to deal with shipping.  The little nine horse briggs is not great on gass either.

I still would have built it but do like to come out even or a bit better.

You mention truck driving.  When I was 16 to 17 years old I thought that would be the coolest job. Then I got a job that I drove to 1.25 hours one way for 26 years.  Road construction one way or the other for half of those years.  I'm so glad I don't drive a truck for a living.  I could have moved closer but I guess I'm a mommas boy cause I couldn't make myself move past the 15 mile area I grew up at.  I did have to move to indiana for about 4 years to get my retirement but moved back as soon as I could.  In indiana I was 5 minutes from work so I used the time to build solar panels which turned out bad and wind turbines which are ok.

You say you worked on farms.  I put up enough hay in my youth and grew up from about 11 to 16 on eighty acres and raise bucket calves and slopped hogs enough to know that it is a hard way to make a good living.  I sure look fondly at the independance and privacy of that 80 acres though.
I don't think I help that many people cause my circle of friends is not that wide for much opertunity to do so but I do try not to be a draw on anyone either.  The only people I abuse most is mom and dad cause dad has much better tools then I do and I am rough on stuff.  His and mine, but he takes it in stride and I try to make up for it in other ways.
Cheers
gww

[Ox]

Here's how I look at the cost vs. savings thing.  Yeah, you have $500 in your mill blades included.  Which is a phenomenal price for something that can produce lumber.  You will always have the mill from here on.  It may take awhile but you'll recoup your money eventually because now every time you see a log you'll be thinking sawlog instead of firewood log.  It'll come back around where you are winning on the money game.  You might see things on the side of the road or have blowdowns, neighbors, friends, etc.
I too have not been able to leave my area of growing up.  I live 4 miles from the homeplace.  I even tried to go to aircraft mechanics school in Alaska (they have the best school for that stuff).  I lasted 2 months and got so homesick and depressed  it felt like I was slowly dying.  It's just the way it is sometimes.
The independence on the farms is just the word I was looking for but staggered my way around it like a drunken fool.  See?  You just helped.   
And I don't have a bunch of people I can help around here either but the way we can help is by remembering there's lots of people that read this forum and by them reading about your mill they'll know what works and what doesn't work.  You may say dozens of people butt-aches by posting pics and discussing in length about everything you've done.
I think this forum is awesome in that I don't feel like an outcast or weirdo anymore.  Every time it gets mentioned that I'm trying to mill lumber I always get, "Why don't you just go buy it?  It's easier."  Well, if money was no issue that's great.  But now I have a mill for the rest of my life and can just keep milling to complete my projects.  Hopefully.  If my health holds out. 

[gww]

Ox
Everybody keeps asking me what I am going to do with it, what do I need the wood for.  I just tell them, I don't know but if I need the wood for something and I decide to do it, I will have wood.
Thanks
gww

[gww]

Picture of my new rickoty speed reducing belt system.



 

Thanks
gww

[Ox]

I get that alot too.  "What are ya gunna do with THAT?"  I hate that $#!&.  What do you care? - Is what I feel like saying.
I think some of it is well camouflaged jealousy.
I think your jackshaft looks great.  And besides, who cares what it looks like as long as it works.  Function first, pretty later.
Maybe someday you'll find a few cans of spray paint on sale and it'll look that much better.
Well done
Good to see you've got the picture thing down.  Someday when I get bored I'll try it.  Very busy right now.