Reverse Roll Quarter Sawing

[WDH]

I didn't think that Yellowhammers and Goats were compatible.  Another thing, Goats ain't fastidious.  (Note to Self:  Fastidious is a pretty big word for a goat to be using on his own.  Maybe he is a Coached Goat). 

[customsawyer]

You do know that there is this thing called Google now right?

[Darrel]

Google for goats.
 

[YellowHammer]

I looked it up.
GOAT is short for "Greatest Of All Time".  It must be true, I saw it on the Internet.

[POSTON WIDEHEAD]

I looked it up.
GOAT is short for "Greatest Of All Time".  It must be true, I saw it on the Internet.

You are now on my Christmas list. 

[kelLOGg]

YH,
Thanks for that link on the LT15 conversion. I just got around to reading it. You essentially built your own hydraulic mill. I don't use my mill much as you so I doubt I will go to the extent you did. Thanks again.
Bob

[WDH]

I reverse rolled quartersawed a white oak log yesterday.  Still getting the hang of it.  One question for YH and others more proficient with this technique.  Sometimes my boards are wider at one end than the other.  Do you use the toeboards to level the log after each major turn?  Because of taper in the log, the gun barrelling does not leave each of the faces the same width all the way from the large end to the small end.

 

 

[Sixacresand]

I loaded a 24" post oak on the mill last week and talked myself out of QS it.  lots of edging work,  The sap wood milled great,. In the heart had diving blade (brand new 4 degree) until I got a narrow cant.  Excessive sawdust left in the kerf.  Is it the nature of post oak or lack of hardwood milling experience? 

[YellowHammer]

I use the toebards a lot, and some taper is very common, however, I do try to find a least one good side with a relatively straight, non tapered face if possible to be the first or best reference face for turning.  Many times I won't use the toeboard to adjust the log, I will just use the clamp to squeeze and go up with it, pinning it against the backstops, lifting at will.  One smaller, very straight logs, I will forgo half of the gunbarreling, and only work the four major faces and leave the other 4 facets with bark on.  Saves a half of work gun barreling, and I have the edge everything anyway, so a little bark on the board isn't a problem.   

4° bands will leave a lot of packed sawdust in white oak.  Typically, I will turn my lube down some with them to keep it dusty, not like wet flour. 

[PA_Walnut]

What yellow said...

Yes, taper is a common challenge and you'll also have tapered edges, so an edger or more time on the mill is part of the game. (an acceptable trade-off to me in order to have rays on each board). On that note, I don't know what I'd ever do without my edger these days...it's ABSOLUTELY a joy to use, in comparison...for me. I have a Baker with a diesel on it, which is probably going later in the year as I'm likely converting to all electric--the mill, edger, etc. since I don't go portable.

Yellow is also spot-on with 4°: they leave PILES on dust behind. I actually go the other direction though and load-up with lube to help the cut not seem like it was chewed through, rather than sawn. I was sawing some HUGE logs the other day that were frozen. Switched from carbide to 4° due to hitting metal and the cut-quality was VASTLY different. (GRRRR  ) The carbide is my choice for almost everything now, except metal. Hitting metal with those pains me, but when dealing with big, high-value material, it's worth it.

Part of our post-process is to very diligently sweep as much dust off the stickered lumber (both sides) as possible. I often use a big leaf blower and post-dust the piles too, after it's dried a bit. In warmer weather and/or troublesome materials, it can make the difference between staining and not. It's a laborious, yet necessary part of our process. And yes, those 4° blades make it twice as hard. 

TIP: I added a time-clock to my ops for my kids. They now clock-in and get paid weekly for actual WORK at the mill. My 11 year old daughter has become a rock star and end-sealer and sweeping boards! 

[YellowHammer]

Today I ran into a relatively common situation, trying to RRQS logs where even the halves are too big for the mill to manipulate well.  For my LT40, this means logs with a large diameter of about 45 inches or better.  Since I had my camera ready, I took some photos. Basically, the strategy is to Reverse the Reverse Roll, i.e. do the normal QS techniques in somewhat reverse order.  Don't gun barrel, simply RRQS with the bark until the cant gets manageable, then trim the bark.

So here we are, with a decent mid forty inch diameter tapered white oak log.  So first break out the 52" chainsaw and split it down the center line.  Using my best @customsawyer chainsaw technique, I split it in half and only missed the center on the far end by an inch or so.  


 

 

 

So now the problem is that the halves are so big, my two plane clamp struggles with them, as wall as my claw.  In addition, I'm out of vertical travel on the mill head and won't clear the log.  I can't begin to manipulate the halves for classic gun barreling. So anyway I can, get the half set up so that the corner is diagonal out toward the idler wheel, which gives me maximum clearance.  Notice the log half is much higher than the head travel, but no problem.  I get the half situated, then measure the distance from the pith to the bed, and raise the toeboards to get the pith level.  



 

Then I take a cut at pretty much max head height take off a decent sized hunk which I will RRQS later.  This now gives me a little clearance to better manipulate the half.  Notice the bark is still on the half, it doesn't matter as long as the pith is level.  

Then I rotate the half just a smudge and line up on a ray and take classic RRQS cuts.  








 
Bullseye, and I keep dropping and taking boards without moving anything.  This lets me trim the cant down to size, but every trim board has good fleck.  Of course it will have bark in one edge, but the point is high fleck QS wood is coming off from the first cuts.  I keep dropping until I get to the pith, and roll the much smaller cant to the other side and repeat the process.  

 
This photo clearly shows how I've rotated the piece and am taking cuts right along the radial cracks, scoring wide QS boards every pass.  

 

Once the cant gets manageable I skin the bark off, wedge trim the pith off and continue to saw it like normal RRQS.  

[fishpharmer]

Tiger oak! 

[PA_Walnut]

Sweet!! This is a nice primer for me since I have a white oak about the exact same size that I need to tackle today or tomorrow.
I did note that you started out with a "BS" log! (see blue paint on end!) 

[customsawyer]

I think BS stands for big sucker.
Good job on the chainsawing. I only hit it perfect when Danny is watching. He adds lots of pressure. Being off by a inch or two isn't the end of the world as you would normally trim out the pith anyway.

[Peter Drouin]

Big logs make wide wood. What is the average size lumber you have?

[tburch]

@YellowHammer I like where you left the bark on initially.  Makes handling a big log much less of a chore.   Also, some time ago, I realized that every board I cut didn't have to have parallel edges throughout it's length.   I've done several fine furniture projects with wedge shaped boards.  

How wide is that board your left hand is on?  

In your first picture, I see, at the back left in your photo, under the shed, what looks to be big pallets or a board stack with tall stickers.  What is that?  My first thought was that they are pallets, queued up, for the next batch of sawn boards you cut to sticker on.  (which would be a great idea)

[teakwood]

One of the most interesting threads on the FF, i have learned so much from it. Thanks for sharing 

[WDH]

I only hit it perfect when Danny is watching.

I must be good luck.  I can be hired to watch .  Better yet, I will trade out some watching for some of your walnut logs .

[YellowHammer]

The bigger logs have been yielding true non pith full S4S boards 12 inch to 18 inch wide.  Most customers have never seen QS boards this wide.  The thing is, these super wide QS boards stay flat and true whereas a flatsawn board this wide would have cup.  

The board in the picture is probably a 15 inch wide, maybe, hard to tell.  My hand is about 7-8 inches wide in that picture.  I've also got some real wide, 20 inch QS boards from the log I milled up the day before.  They will be a shade narrower when I edge them.  

The nice thing about this technique is it allows me to get the widest boards possible because it's not a step by step process, it's flexible enough to get the big boards when they present themselves.  The average width of my QS boards has gone up vs conventional techniques.  I don't know what the average width is, but we have a top rack full of none less than 12 inch. I try to not get narrower than 4 inches. 

One of the most important things about this technique, as demonstrated on this big log, is I never had to handle conventional quarters manually, and I never had to lay my hands on the log half from start to finish.  Once it's on the mill, it's all hydraulics, and old school hydraulics at that. 

Also, some may remember how I said I didn't like to Anchorseal logs when I knew I would QS them.  This log is a prime example.  The radial splits are a blueprint on where to cut.  Only after the boards are deadstacked, do I pack saw the boards to 8 feet long and Anchorseal.  

You are correct Tburch, those are pallets staged for use.

[caveman]

Robert, those are beautiful quarter sawn boards. Question, do you dead stack off of the mill, cut and anchor seal and then sticker stack them?  

One more question.  This is for any who do a lot of quarter sawing.  What is the minimum diameter log that you typically quarter saw?